Why did the Chinese send flies and plants to the far side of the moon?
$begingroup$
The Chinese space craft that just landed on the moon had a tube with a biosphere in with flies and plants. What are they expecting to learn? Didn't we already experiment that on the ISS?
Source
Chinese scientists released this image of a cotton plant germinating in its tank on the moon aboard the Chang'e 4 lander. The photograph was taken Jan. 7, 2019. Credit: Chongqing University
iss the-moon atmosphere life chang-e
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
$endgroup$
migrated from astronomy.stackexchange.com 11 hours ago
This question came from our site for astronomers and astrophysicists.
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The Chinese space craft that just landed on the moon had a tube with a biosphere in with flies and plants. What are they expecting to learn? Didn't we already experiment that on the ISS?
Source
Chinese scientists released this image of a cotton plant germinating in its tank on the moon aboard the Chang'e 4 lander. The photograph was taken Jan. 7, 2019. Credit: Chongqing University
iss the-moon atmosphere life chang-e
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
$endgroup$
migrated from astronomy.stackexchange.com 11 hours ago
This question came from our site for astronomers and astrophysicists.
1
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Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
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– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The Chinese space craft that just landed on the moon had a tube with a biosphere in with flies and plants. What are they expecting to learn? Didn't we already experiment that on the ISS?
Source
Chinese scientists released this image of a cotton plant germinating in its tank on the moon aboard the Chang'e 4 lander. The photograph was taken Jan. 7, 2019. Credit: Chongqing University
iss the-moon atmosphere life chang-e
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
$endgroup$
The Chinese space craft that just landed on the moon had a tube with a biosphere in with flies and plants. What are they expecting to learn? Didn't we already experiment that on the ISS?
Source
Chinese scientists released this image of a cotton plant germinating in its tank on the moon aboard the Chang'e 4 lander. The photograph was taken Jan. 7, 2019. Credit: Chongqing University
iss the-moon atmosphere life chang-e
iss the-moon atmosphere life chang-e
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
edited 1 hour ago
jonvyltra
545
545
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
asked 11 hours ago
Geordi La ForgeGeordi La Forge
462
462
migrated from astronomy.stackexchange.com 11 hours ago
This question came from our site for astronomers and astrophysicists.
migrated from astronomy.stackexchange.com 11 hours ago
This question came from our site for astronomers and astrophysicists.
1
$begingroup$
Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
$endgroup$
– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
$endgroup$
– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago
1
1
$begingroup$
Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
$endgroup$
– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
$endgroup$
– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Right now, almost 100% of existing research on growth in gravity fields is basically at 0g (ISS/Mir/Skylab/whatever) or 1g.
There are a lot of questions of what happens at 1/6g or 2/3g? No good experiments to demonstrate.
Thus the Chinese lander is testing 1/6th g.
SpaceX is likely to brute force test 38% g when they get to Mars. It is entirely possible that mitigation techniques developed for 0g are not useful or needed or effective at 38% g.
The Space Studies Institute (Via Gary Hudson, of Rotary Rocket infamy (alas)) is pushing for something they call G-Lab, an orbital facility with a control facility, at 0g and then a centrifuge at some other value.
If you are interested in this topic, there is an excellent "The Space Show with David Livingston" episode where Gary Hudson discusses this issue. The Space Show does not allow transcripts so I cannot link to anything like that, you are left with only listening.
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The capsule and its seeds are stored on the Chang'e 4 lander. It protects the biosphere from the positive +/-200C degree temperature swings. They are basically experimenting to see how life evolves and survives in near zero gravity. Unlike the ISS where they essentially tested the same concept just in Zero Gravity. Learning this will better prepare humanity for populating other planets as well as long space travel time.
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Right now, almost 100% of existing research on growth in gravity fields is basically at 0g (ISS/Mir/Skylab/whatever) or 1g.
There are a lot of questions of what happens at 1/6g or 2/3g? No good experiments to demonstrate.
Thus the Chinese lander is testing 1/6th g.
SpaceX is likely to brute force test 38% g when they get to Mars. It is entirely possible that mitigation techniques developed for 0g are not useful or needed or effective at 38% g.
The Space Studies Institute (Via Gary Hudson, of Rotary Rocket infamy (alas)) is pushing for something they call G-Lab, an orbital facility with a control facility, at 0g and then a centrifuge at some other value.
If you are interested in this topic, there is an excellent "The Space Show with David Livingston" episode where Gary Hudson discusses this issue. The Space Show does not allow transcripts so I cannot link to anything like that, you are left with only listening.
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Right now, almost 100% of existing research on growth in gravity fields is basically at 0g (ISS/Mir/Skylab/whatever) or 1g.
There are a lot of questions of what happens at 1/6g or 2/3g? No good experiments to demonstrate.
Thus the Chinese lander is testing 1/6th g.
SpaceX is likely to brute force test 38% g when they get to Mars. It is entirely possible that mitigation techniques developed for 0g are not useful or needed or effective at 38% g.
The Space Studies Institute (Via Gary Hudson, of Rotary Rocket infamy (alas)) is pushing for something they call G-Lab, an orbital facility with a control facility, at 0g and then a centrifuge at some other value.
If you are interested in this topic, there is an excellent "The Space Show with David Livingston" episode where Gary Hudson discusses this issue. The Space Show does not allow transcripts so I cannot link to anything like that, you are left with only listening.
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Right now, almost 100% of existing research on growth in gravity fields is basically at 0g (ISS/Mir/Skylab/whatever) or 1g.
There are a lot of questions of what happens at 1/6g or 2/3g? No good experiments to demonstrate.
Thus the Chinese lander is testing 1/6th g.
SpaceX is likely to brute force test 38% g when they get to Mars. It is entirely possible that mitigation techniques developed for 0g are not useful or needed or effective at 38% g.
The Space Studies Institute (Via Gary Hudson, of Rotary Rocket infamy (alas)) is pushing for something they call G-Lab, an orbital facility with a control facility, at 0g and then a centrifuge at some other value.
If you are interested in this topic, there is an excellent "The Space Show with David Livingston" episode where Gary Hudson discusses this issue. The Space Show does not allow transcripts so I cannot link to anything like that, you are left with only listening.
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
$endgroup$
Right now, almost 100% of existing research on growth in gravity fields is basically at 0g (ISS/Mir/Skylab/whatever) or 1g.
There are a lot of questions of what happens at 1/6g or 2/3g? No good experiments to demonstrate.
Thus the Chinese lander is testing 1/6th g.
SpaceX is likely to brute force test 38% g when they get to Mars. It is entirely possible that mitigation techniques developed for 0g are not useful or needed or effective at 38% g.
The Space Studies Institute (Via Gary Hudson, of Rotary Rocket infamy (alas)) is pushing for something they call G-Lab, an orbital facility with a control facility, at 0g and then a centrifuge at some other value.
If you are interested in this topic, there is an excellent "The Space Show with David Livingston" episode where Gary Hudson discusses this issue. The Space Show does not allow transcripts so I cannot link to anything like that, you are left with only listening.
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
edited 7 hours ago
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
answered 11 hours ago
geoffcgeoffc
54.7k8160306
54.7k8160306
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
I suspect it would actually have been cheaper to build a dedicated ⅙g artificial-gravity mission in LEO for these experiments (basically need only tether the tubes to a counterweight and spin it up with a monopropellant thruster), than to add them to the moon mission with its much higher Δv demand. Just, “first plant in ⅙g” doesn't have quite the PR ring that “first plant on the moon” has.
$endgroup$
– leftaroundabout
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Putting a small spinning plant on the ISS seems a lot easier for low G experiments too, even just two hanging flowerpots on a string, or a centrifuge
$endgroup$
– Xen2050
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
$begingroup$
@leftaroundabout: A low-g centrifuge in LEO would only test growing plants in a centrifuge in LEO. Growing them on the moon tests growing them in the actual lunar environment. Of course for a full test, they should have scooped up some lunar "soil" and tried growing plants in that.
$endgroup$
– jamesqf
29 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The capsule and its seeds are stored on the Chang'e 4 lander. It protects the biosphere from the positive +/-200C degree temperature swings. They are basically experimenting to see how life evolves and survives in near zero gravity. Unlike the ISS where they essentially tested the same concept just in Zero Gravity. Learning this will better prepare humanity for populating other planets as well as long space travel time.
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The capsule and its seeds are stored on the Chang'e 4 lander. It protects the biosphere from the positive +/-200C degree temperature swings. They are basically experimenting to see how life evolves and survives in near zero gravity. Unlike the ISS where they essentially tested the same concept just in Zero Gravity. Learning this will better prepare humanity for populating other planets as well as long space travel time.
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The capsule and its seeds are stored on the Chang'e 4 lander. It protects the biosphere from the positive +/-200C degree temperature swings. They are basically experimenting to see how life evolves and survives in near zero gravity. Unlike the ISS where they essentially tested the same concept just in Zero Gravity. Learning this will better prepare humanity for populating other planets as well as long space travel time.
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
$endgroup$
The capsule and its seeds are stored on the Chang'e 4 lander. It protects the biosphere from the positive +/-200C degree temperature swings. They are basically experimenting to see how life evolves and survives in near zero gravity. Unlike the ISS where they essentially tested the same concept just in Zero Gravity. Learning this will better prepare humanity for populating other planets as well as long space travel time.
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
answered 11 hours ago
KingsInnerSoulKingsInnerSoul
4521413
4521413
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
add a comment |
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
Do they have counter plans in case the plants get sick and so on?
$endgroup$
– Geordi La Forge
11 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
The unprecedented plan to create life in outer space is the most intriguing part of China's lunar probe mission later this year, and could be a major boost for dreams that humans will one day live on the Moon. "Our experiment might help accumulate knowledge for building a lunar base and long-term residence on the Moon," Professor Liu - So yeah, I assume they do have contingency plans.
$endgroup$
– KingsInnerSoul
11 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@GeordiLaForge Counter plans like what? It's on the far side of the moon. If it dies, it dies.
$endgroup$
– Graham
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Graham Doesn't preclude contingency plans, like designing the experiment with two redundant chambers, so that the opportunity for science isn't wasted. Like the backup spider they flew on the ISS.
$endgroup$
– user71659
5 hours ago
add a comment |
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1
$begingroup$
Could you please provide a link to the image's source?
$endgroup$
– Jules
7 hours ago
$begingroup$
duplicate of space.stackexchange.com/questions/33479/…?
$endgroup$
– user17915
10 mins ago