Do commercial flights continue with an engine out?
$begingroup$
Do commercial flights continue with an engine failure? If you look closely at the attached picture it seems that one of the engines has a much smaller contrail than the other three. This seems to suggest that the aircraft is flying on three engines with the one at reduced (idle?) power. Is this normal?
commercial-aviation engine-failure emergency-procedures contrails
New contributor
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Do commercial flights continue with an engine failure? If you look closely at the attached picture it seems that one of the engines has a much smaller contrail than the other three. This seems to suggest that the aircraft is flying on three engines with the one at reduced (idle?) power. Is this normal?
commercial-aviation engine-failure emergency-procedures contrails
New contributor
$endgroup$
6
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
7
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Do commercial flights continue with an engine failure? If you look closely at the attached picture it seems that one of the engines has a much smaller contrail than the other three. This seems to suggest that the aircraft is flying on three engines with the one at reduced (idle?) power. Is this normal?
commercial-aviation engine-failure emergency-procedures contrails
New contributor
$endgroup$
Do commercial flights continue with an engine failure? If you look closely at the attached picture it seems that one of the engines has a much smaller contrail than the other three. This seems to suggest that the aircraft is flying on three engines with the one at reduced (idle?) power. Is this normal?
commercial-aviation engine-failure emergency-procedures contrails
commercial-aviation engine-failure emergency-procedures contrails
New contributor
New contributor
edited 9 hours ago
ymb1
66.4k7211353
66.4k7211353
New contributor
asked 11 hours ago
Bruce WhitesideBruce Whiteside
292
292
New contributor
New contributor
6
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
7
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago
add a comment |
6
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
7
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago
6
6
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
7
7
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The image looks like four engines running at the same cruise thrust. The wake vortex is blowing the exhaust of the inboard engines down and the exhaust of the outboard engines out and in the perspective of this image this makes the lower two streams look merged while the upper ones further apart. Close behind the engines it is clear there is four of them and all have similar strength.
That said, a four-engine aircraft may continue on three engines as far as it has enough fuel. With one engine out it can't maintain as high altitude, so it has to drift down to lower altitude where it flies slower and thus has shorter range. However if they have enough contingency fuel, they can continue to destination. Or return back to departure point, or proceed towards the destination, but land somewhere short. The dispatcher will consider the repairs, taking care of the passengers, rebooking them, the next flight the plane was scheduled for and other things and tell the pilots which is the preferred option.
In contrast a two-engine aircraft shall land as soon as possible. One engine out of two means there is no redundancy left and that is an emergency and shall be handled as such. Note that as soon as possible does not necessarily mean closest airport—the aircraft will cover over 100 NM during normal descent from cruise altitude, so if there are more options in about 150 NM, the pilots and dispatcher still get to choose.
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The above is correct...sort of. Say a DAL MD88 blows a motor (far-fetched, I know...) and it’s somewhere between CLT and ATL, with CLT being the nearest divert. That aircraft, barring some sort of additional emergency (fire, deco, etc) is likely to continue/divert to ATL, as it is the tech base for DAL. So while they land immediately, they will also err on the side of easiest/best repair facility.
New contributor
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
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votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The image looks like four engines running at the same cruise thrust. The wake vortex is blowing the exhaust of the inboard engines down and the exhaust of the outboard engines out and in the perspective of this image this makes the lower two streams look merged while the upper ones further apart. Close behind the engines it is clear there is four of them and all have similar strength.
That said, a four-engine aircraft may continue on three engines as far as it has enough fuel. With one engine out it can't maintain as high altitude, so it has to drift down to lower altitude where it flies slower and thus has shorter range. However if they have enough contingency fuel, they can continue to destination. Or return back to departure point, or proceed towards the destination, but land somewhere short. The dispatcher will consider the repairs, taking care of the passengers, rebooking them, the next flight the plane was scheduled for and other things and tell the pilots which is the preferred option.
In contrast a two-engine aircraft shall land as soon as possible. One engine out of two means there is no redundancy left and that is an emergency and shall be handled as such. Note that as soon as possible does not necessarily mean closest airport—the aircraft will cover over 100 NM during normal descent from cruise altitude, so if there are more options in about 150 NM, the pilots and dispatcher still get to choose.
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The image looks like four engines running at the same cruise thrust. The wake vortex is blowing the exhaust of the inboard engines down and the exhaust of the outboard engines out and in the perspective of this image this makes the lower two streams look merged while the upper ones further apart. Close behind the engines it is clear there is four of them and all have similar strength.
That said, a four-engine aircraft may continue on three engines as far as it has enough fuel. With one engine out it can't maintain as high altitude, so it has to drift down to lower altitude where it flies slower and thus has shorter range. However if they have enough contingency fuel, they can continue to destination. Or return back to departure point, or proceed towards the destination, but land somewhere short. The dispatcher will consider the repairs, taking care of the passengers, rebooking them, the next flight the plane was scheduled for and other things and tell the pilots which is the preferred option.
In contrast a two-engine aircraft shall land as soon as possible. One engine out of two means there is no redundancy left and that is an emergency and shall be handled as such. Note that as soon as possible does not necessarily mean closest airport—the aircraft will cover over 100 NM during normal descent from cruise altitude, so if there are more options in about 150 NM, the pilots and dispatcher still get to choose.
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The image looks like four engines running at the same cruise thrust. The wake vortex is blowing the exhaust of the inboard engines down and the exhaust of the outboard engines out and in the perspective of this image this makes the lower two streams look merged while the upper ones further apart. Close behind the engines it is clear there is four of them and all have similar strength.
That said, a four-engine aircraft may continue on three engines as far as it has enough fuel. With one engine out it can't maintain as high altitude, so it has to drift down to lower altitude where it flies slower and thus has shorter range. However if they have enough contingency fuel, they can continue to destination. Or return back to departure point, or proceed towards the destination, but land somewhere short. The dispatcher will consider the repairs, taking care of the passengers, rebooking them, the next flight the plane was scheduled for and other things and tell the pilots which is the preferred option.
In contrast a two-engine aircraft shall land as soon as possible. One engine out of two means there is no redundancy left and that is an emergency and shall be handled as such. Note that as soon as possible does not necessarily mean closest airport—the aircraft will cover over 100 NM during normal descent from cruise altitude, so if there are more options in about 150 NM, the pilots and dispatcher still get to choose.
$endgroup$
The image looks like four engines running at the same cruise thrust. The wake vortex is blowing the exhaust of the inboard engines down and the exhaust of the outboard engines out and in the perspective of this image this makes the lower two streams look merged while the upper ones further apart. Close behind the engines it is clear there is four of them and all have similar strength.
That said, a four-engine aircraft may continue on three engines as far as it has enough fuel. With one engine out it can't maintain as high altitude, so it has to drift down to lower altitude where it flies slower and thus has shorter range. However if they have enough contingency fuel, they can continue to destination. Or return back to departure point, or proceed towards the destination, but land somewhere short. The dispatcher will consider the repairs, taking care of the passengers, rebooking them, the next flight the plane was scheduled for and other things and tell the pilots which is the preferred option.
In contrast a two-engine aircraft shall land as soon as possible. One engine out of two means there is no redundancy left and that is an emergency and shall be handled as such. Note that as soon as possible does not necessarily mean closest airport—the aircraft will cover over 100 NM during normal descent from cruise altitude, so if there are more options in about 150 NM, the pilots and dispatcher still get to choose.
edited 5 hours ago
answered 10 hours ago
Jan HudecJan Hudec
39.5k3101192
39.5k3101192
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
"Land as soon as possible" may give the wrong impression, since twin engine aircraft are routinely used for flights over oceans. In fact the longest flight certification for a twin engine aircraft after an engine failure is now 370 minutes (just over 6 hours) before landing for the Airbus A350XWB.
$endgroup$
– alephzero
4 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@alephzero If the nearest airport is indeed 370 single-engine minutes away, then there's no choice. But FAA rules (Part 121.565) are specific in that you must land with the least amount of flight time unless there's a safety reason, and in that case you must file a report with the FAA. The common term is "land at nearest suitable airport".
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The above is correct...sort of. Say a DAL MD88 blows a motor (far-fetched, I know...) and it’s somewhere between CLT and ATL, with CLT being the nearest divert. That aircraft, barring some sort of additional emergency (fire, deco, etc) is likely to continue/divert to ATL, as it is the tech base for DAL. So while they land immediately, they will also err on the side of easiest/best repair facility.
New contributor
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The above is correct...sort of. Say a DAL MD88 blows a motor (far-fetched, I know...) and it’s somewhere between CLT and ATL, with CLT being the nearest divert. That aircraft, barring some sort of additional emergency (fire, deco, etc) is likely to continue/divert to ATL, as it is the tech base for DAL. So while they land immediately, they will also err on the side of easiest/best repair facility.
New contributor
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The above is correct...sort of. Say a DAL MD88 blows a motor (far-fetched, I know...) and it’s somewhere between CLT and ATL, with CLT being the nearest divert. That aircraft, barring some sort of additional emergency (fire, deco, etc) is likely to continue/divert to ATL, as it is the tech base for DAL. So while they land immediately, they will also err on the side of easiest/best repair facility.
New contributor
$endgroup$
The above is correct...sort of. Say a DAL MD88 blows a motor (far-fetched, I know...) and it’s somewhere between CLT and ATL, with CLT being the nearest divert. That aircraft, barring some sort of additional emergency (fire, deco, etc) is likely to continue/divert to ATL, as it is the tech base for DAL. So while they land immediately, they will also err on the side of easiest/best repair facility.
New contributor
New contributor
answered 8 hours ago
propgunonepropgunone
1
1
New contributor
New contributor
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
When this kind of stuff happens the diversion location is often determined by discussion between Maintenance Control and the Capt, subject to being overridden by the Capt if the Capt wants to get down sooner or closer.
$endgroup$
– John K
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, the aircraft will still cover over 100 NM in just the normal descent, so there is no point selecting the closest if there is a better option in that range.
$endgroup$
– Jan Hudec
5 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
Welcome to SE, @prop. Note that "The above ..." doesn't make any sense on this site as answers float up and down with user votes or sorting preference. Instead, refer to the author's username.
$endgroup$
– Transistor
5 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This is not true. FAA regulations are specific that the event of a engine failure on a twin, the airplane must land at the airport that results in the least flying time (Part 121.565) unless there is a safety-related reason. Commercial factors and repair do not count, and extending the flight for maintenance reasons has resulted in FAA enforcement action.
$endgroup$
– user71659
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
$begingroup$
This does not provide an answer to the question. Once you have sufficient reputation you will be able to comment on any post; instead, provide answers that don't require clarification from the asker. - From Review
$endgroup$
– Sean
16 mins ago
add a comment |
Bruce Whiteside is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Bruce Whiteside is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Bruce Whiteside is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Bruce Whiteside is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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6
$begingroup$
There's clearly 4 contrails there.
$endgroup$
– GdD
8 hours ago
7
$begingroup$
The chemtrail tank for one of the engines ran dry. Perfectly normal. Try not to think about it.
$endgroup$
– Bob Jarvis
4 hours ago